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General => The Colosseum => Topic started by: jj2007 on June 02, 2017, 10:11:25 PM

Title: Visual Crap Community
Post by: jj2007 on June 02, 2017, 10:11:25 PM
Just launched VS, every now and then I give it a try.

It takes minutes to open and load a hello world proggie. In contrast, loading the 32k lines of MasmBasic, or the 19k of RichMasm costs under one second.

Building a hello world proggie takes ages, too (RichMasm: <1 second).

It rarely succeeds in building a hello world proggie. Usually, you get lousy cryptic errors like
Code: [Select]
Severity Code Description Project File Line Suppression State
Error MSB8020 The build tools for v141 (Platform Toolset = 'v141') cannot be found. To build using the v141 build tools, please install v141 build tools.  Alternatively, you may upgrade to the current Visual Studio tools by selecting the Project menu or right-click the solution, and then selecting "Retarget solution". GRNMASM C:\Program Files (x86)\MSBuild\Microsoft.Cpp\v4.0\V140\Microsoft.Cpp.Platform.targets 57

When you select e.g. SendMessage and press Ctrl F1 for help, VS does ... nothing. If you are lucky, you may notice that a new browser window opened, in the background. It greets you with "Welcome to Visual Studio 2015", but it won't tell you anything about SendMessage.

If you select SendMessage and hit F1 (without Ctrl, we are trying to be courageous), another new browser window opens, again in the background. If you hit F1 repeatedly, every time a new browser window opens, and they all show the same: a page on "Writing Code in the Code and Text Editor" 8)

If you choose "Launch in help viewer", it complains that you haven't downloaded any content yet. There are some gigabytes of "help" from the previous VS version, which is still active, but M$ doesn't communicate with Microsoft, it seems.

Etc etc etc ... VS is just an incredibly lousy immature crappy piece of s**tware. So why are there people who call it "the best IDE"??? Are the others even worse?  ::)

SHUDDER :shock:
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: hutch-- on June 02, 2017, 10:37:10 PM
 :biggrin:

Like the faithful during the black plague performing self flagellation, you do it to punish yourself, right ?  :P
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: jj2007 on June 02, 2017, 10:49:51 PM
No, I'm not a masochist. But curious, yes. A few weeks ago I started using a "smart" phone, with Android, of course. Horrible experience, how can Millions of users tolerate such confusing crap? No right-click equivalent, to give just one example.
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: felipe on June 03, 2017, 01:02:11 AM
Horrible experience, how can Millions of users tolerate such confusing crap?

While curiosity is the mother of  knowledge, massive masochism is father of ignorance.  :lol:
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: anta40 on June 03, 2017, 02:33:15 AM
So why are there people who call it "the best IDE"???

Depend on which folks.
.NET (C#, F#, VB .NET etc) devs will obviously use VS on Windows, and not Mono
C++ devs will also use it.

I mainly use Java for work (desktop and Android apps), so my weapon of choice are Netbeans and Android Studio.

Yes, admittedly those IDEs are huge, bloated, probably take minutes to start (hint: get bigger RAM and switch to SSD :P),
but for us application programmers who need to able to handle desktop, web, and mobile solutions, they are ready to use.
Convenient.

Are the others even worse?  ::)

SHUDDER :shock:

GNU Emacs, probably. Feel free to ask die hard UNIX folks :P
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: Vortex on June 03, 2017, 03:11:34 AM
Hi Jochen,

I agree with all your comments. Remembering the quote below :

Quote
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein

We are living in the age of mass propaganda. Those big corporations are washing the brain of folks who are ready to believe blindly to whatever they say. With the decreasing level of education and the harsh capitalism pumping always the desire of endless consumption, humanity is losing conscience and reasoning. In the previous centuries, intellectuals had to learn Latin and the old Greek. This practice is gone away since longtime ago. Ultra-capitalism wants ignorance and stupidity to sell whatever to the folks.

Me too, I dislike the smart phones exactly for the same reasons. Sadly, the same mechanism of hypnotization is responsible for the sales success of those devices.

Humanity should look for liberation but people are preferring enslavement which is easier for them.
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: jj2007 on June 03, 2017, 05:30:59 AM
I agree with all your comments

Thanks, Erol. Good to see that you and Albert agree with me ;)
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: nidud on June 03, 2017, 05:57:22 AM
Monopoly, sales and marketing vs tool making:

https://youtu.be/TRZAJY23xio?t=1542
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: hutch-- on June 03, 2017, 06:09:58 AM
This video contains content from Warner Bros. Entertainment, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds.
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: anunitu on June 03, 2017, 06:30:20 AM
Got the same Hutch,wonder where exactly you "Could" view it. :dazzled:
Mine showed this.
This video contains content from Magnolia, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds.

Wonder why a Steve Jobs interview would really be that copyright concerned. The guy is dead and gone after all.

Not really much interest in him lately in X86 circles.

Also "Smart" phones are very over rated.

I would more likely watch an interview with the "WAZ"

http://www.cultofmac.com/465599/steve-wozniak-leaves-apple/

Jobs was just a sales guy really,not a tech guy.
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: nidud on June 03, 2017, 06:56:23 AM
It's an old interview where Steve Jobs predict the future of Apple and Microsoft.

This is a short version:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AxZofbMGpM
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: hutch-- on June 03, 2017, 07:21:58 AM
The shorter one is a good interview and says in a nutshell what has happened to most of the computer industry, the IT Morons take over, PHUK the company and wind up the sales pitch. Back about 1990 Microsoft were a great company, the janitor could code a viable floppy boot sector and the switch girl could explain which C version was the best for your task. Then the monopoly seduced management and the tech folks started to get the shove.

The Gates era at least produced some decent code where Ballmer seriously PHUKED Microsoft. They survived on XP then later Win7 but much of this was written back in the Gates era. Now we have "NONAME" with his head in the "Cloud" after one technical flop after another and they still wonder why every new initiative falls flat on its arse. Last time I had to contact Microsoft years ago, when you mentioned a programming language you got a "pro-what" response.  :P
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: felipe on June 03, 2017, 02:23:07 PM
I agree that capitalism make a lot of people idiot, but no automaticly. For example, you can see on tv (at least local tv, in some country X) how idiot are some people that work there, and how idiot is their work. So then those idiots becomes a product to the open market (in this case the media industry). So people that watch  those others been idiots, do because they just accept that on tv. They accept those kinds of works too (from the media), without make some criticism. So finally stupidity becomes bread of all days. That's, we have productors and consumers... :eusa_snooty:
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: jj2007 on July 04, 2017, 04:44:24 AM
The Gates era at least produced some decent code

Just had a remarkable experience with Win7-64: When copying files to a USB stick, it got thoroughly stuck. The whole machine froze until I pulled out the USB stick. Bad idea! When reinserting it, Explorer showed a message box: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted. And one more: This drive needs to be formatted.

... hundreds of these boxes, the only solution was to kill Explorer via Ctrl Alt Del.

Then I tried formatting from Win10, no luck. A 32GB stick lost. Fortunately, I have backups 8)

If Bill Gates had to pay all the damage that he caused, he would be the poorest man on Earth.
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: Siekmanski on July 04, 2017, 05:04:59 AM
If you meant that the USB stick is useless, then try this sd formatter. It has an option, "format size adjustment". After setting this option,  I was able to use the USB stick again.

https://www.sdcard.org/downloads/formatter_4/
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: jj2007 on July 04, 2017, 05:42:51 AM
Just tried it - no success: "formatting failed". The stick is gone apparently :(
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: hutch-- on July 04, 2017, 07:15:09 AM
I have had a usb3 stick die on me, I got it back from a friend, went to delete the content and it gave up the ghost, tried everything but it was stone dead so I eventually threw it out.
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: nidud on July 04, 2017, 08:02:01 AM
You could try the command line version of format. Maybe that will suppress the message loop or at least give you some readable error information.
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: jj2007 on July 04, 2017, 08:32:34 AM
This one had shown signs of fatigue for a while - recognised only on 2nd or 3rd attempt etc. No brand name on the outside, but I liked its shape. Well... just ordered a SanDisk Ultra Fit 3.0 32GB. Enough for all my sources :biggrin:

@nidud: I tried that but no luck. That drive is gone :(
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: hutch-- on July 04, 2017, 01:59:49 PM
I just grabbed 2 x 32 gig USB2 drives from my local post office for $10.0 AUD each, formatted the first one and benchmarked it and it runs at a very respectable 38 meg/sec. I need a coupe of these older ones as I get video from Youtube for an old bloke who is a friend of mine so he can watch things that he would not normally have access at.
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: felipe on July 05, 2017, 02:49:29 AM
It's probably dead jj. Maybe if you want to try one more thing, it would be a good idea to try to fix it in a different O.S environment (linux, gnu/linux or whatever of those ones) with tools provided for those environments.   :icon_exclaim:
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: anunitu on July 05, 2017, 10:21:06 AM
At the small price for most "Sticks",not really worth it to try to revive one,because they could die if you used them for serious data use.
Better to burn your data on a CD or DVD
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: sinsi on July 05, 2017, 10:47:06 AM
Try plugging a USB stick in when the room is dark, quite often you will see a flash as the connection is made. A lot of drives and/or ports aren't very well insulated, the flash is the electricity killing the drive  :(

>Better to burn your data on a CD or DVD
I've burned a DVD and accidentally left it in the car on a hot sunny day. That was enough to erase it.
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: anunitu on July 05, 2017, 12:15:09 PM
But that has more to do with Your forgetting ,than to the use of CD/DVD'S for saving data. If I drop one in a toaster,that is my BAD! :icon_rolleyes: :icon_redface:

You might consider clay tablets to record your data,they seem to last for 1000nds of years. :biggrin:

(http://eduscapes.com/history/beginnings/Ebla_clay_tablet.jpg)
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: jj2007 on July 05, 2017, 07:19:06 PM
You might consider clay tablets to record your data,they seem to last for 1000nds of years. :biggrin:

Looks fairly reliable :t

Can you give me a rough estimate how many clay tablets I need for my 5,041 assembler sources?
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: hutch-- on July 05, 2017, 10:01:19 PM
> they seem to last for 1000nds of years

Yeah yeah, as long as they don't get wet or dropped.  :biggrin:
Title: Re: Visual Crap Community
Post by: npnw on July 11, 2017, 05:59:19 PM
hutch,

Reminds me of a joke.

Mel Brooks said " God gave the jews 15 commandments".  "Moses then tripped, and God gave them 10 commandments".