Going back to Windows 7 from 10: how?

[jj2007]

Need for Speed - C++ versus Assembly Language

http://masm32.com/board/index.php?topic=5650.msg60101#msg60101
http://masm32.com/board/index.php?topic=6163.0

aw27 alias José A. Pascoa: I updated the article "Need for Speed - C++ versus Assembly Language", now it includes C# and Free Pascal on the run as well. Now, ASM wins hands down in both cases, particularly for C#

Besides, picking one particular isolated problem to demonstrate that one language is superior to another is nonsense. You need a sophisticated benchmark procedure comprising float and integer match, string creation and handling, parsing, sorting and much more to demonstrate anything useful.

[hutch--]

 

[jack]

jj
I don't get it, the programs all use assembly helper code, it would be a more interesting comparison if the high level languages didn't use asm, or perhaps they have the use of asm as an option?

[Shintaro]

[]Need for Speed - C++ versus Assembly Language

I have to wonder about the impact of timings on code as highlighted by Michael Abrash (Zen of Assembly).
Abrash seemed to fix the Windows NT Device Driver code using methods like timing.
Is it still worth thinking about with modern CPU's?
Also, there is the bias of comparing MS VS 2015 with JWASM last release by Japheth 2014? Comparing a team vs a single person.

Perhaps a more fair comparison is to compare the code with MS VS 2013.

[hutch--]

 

Besides, picking one particular isolated problem to demonstrate that one language is superior to another is nonsense. You need a sophisticated benchmark procedure comprising float and integer match, string creation and handling, parsing, sorting and much more to demonstrate anything useful.

This is spot on, digging up some obscure technical problem and waxing lyrical about some language or another is nonsense. Then there is the skill of the operator with 2 or more languages and no garrantee that either is good enough to do a comparison.

Just as an example, there are times when an OOP language produces some very fast code but as usual, when you look under the hood, its good old fashioned procedural code that has been highly optimised over a longer period. Then there is the less than highly skilled analysis of the internals of compiler generated code where in reality, obscurity by the compiler designer is the factor for its layout.

Yet another factor is the absolute algorithm design, I have as an example, a Sedgewick / Bentley sort that is very fast built with a compiler and apart from porting it to 32 bit MASM and PowerBASIC as well as 64 bit MASM, nothing would make it any faster. Wasted a lot of time trying to manually optimise it by kicking the guts out of it and they all produced the same timings. Effectively, an algorithm optimised by design.

We used to hear this bullsh*t that good compiler code would beat (in speed terms) poor assembler code but such nonsense is applicable to any pair of binary languages.

Good ............ with beat bad ............ in speed terms. Just fill in the blanks for any pair of languages.

I always liked AW27, a clever guy who wrote decent code and knew enough about assembler to at least make some comparison, but the comparison was as good as the example chosen.

[NoCforMe]

Well, to get this topic back on track, I'm sitting here typing on my "new" Windows 7 computah. Installation went relatively straightforward; only bump was a loooooong (~30 min.) wait on the last part of the "finishing up" phase, where I started to think the installation code was hung.

But after installation the fun starts. This is only the second time I've done a clean "out-of-the-box" Windows install (last time was W2K, when I had help from techies at my company), so I didn't realize how not-ready-to-use the OS would be after installation.

First rude surprise was that I couldn't load a single goddamn website with IE, which was the only browser installed, even though there was nothing wrong with my internet connection. Well, I got a clue the trouble was IE or internet settings when I found I could load some Micro$oft sites (MSN news, for one). Turned out the problem wasn't even internet settings: it was program authorization settings that had to be changed. So then I went to Dell's web site to download drivers. However, because internet stuff was still messed up, even though I could get to most sites, the site didn't render properly; apparently didn't load CSS or Java or something, so it was unusable. (This was with Opera, my preferred browser.) It wasn't until I installed Firefox that I was able to access sites properly.

Well, Dell was pretty much a bust. They do have a whole shitload of drivers available; almost all of them failed to install for one reason or another. I did get a couple system upgrades that they said were crucial, and things seem to be running fine in any case, but that was disappointing. (I guess that's what you get when you try to get stuff for a 12-year-old OS, huh?)

So long story short, everything's fine, well, except for Opera, which complains about privacy issues on about half the sites I access (not this one, interestingly, even though it's flagged as "Not secure"). Hopefully I'll find the tweak(s) needed to fix this. I've been through all the internet options with no luck yet.

Anyhow, it's good to be back on 7 and not on that horrible 10. Now I've just got to reinstall every damn piece of software I use ...

BTW, I bought the DVD on eBay, and the seller ("zhou_pc", Chinese guy) is one of the good ones. He sent along a one-page info sheet about how to solve some common installation problems, writes really clear concise English and seems to know his stuff. Wish more sellers were like him.

[zedd151]

When you do install all your essential software, make sure to make a backup image of the OS in that clean state, before adding non essential things. This way, you'll always have a clean ready to use OS in case anything goes sideways in the future. And if you need to tweak settings or whatever afterward make a backup of that as well.
I keep a clean backup of OS and only drivers. Another with essential software included, yet another without added browser in case I want to change the web browser in the future without uninstalling one and removing all the leftover crap (after browser uninstall)

[zedd151]

I also recommend keeping projects, documents anything personal on a drive other than where windows is installed, so no need for transferring all that if need to do a restore from backup. In other words plan ahead in case some sort of catastrophe strikes

[hutch--]

David,

I did a clean install of Win7 64 Ultimate a bit under a year ago and got it to work OK by getting the service pack that I had archived to update it. Hunted around for any other drivers I could find, some archived and some from vendor sites, and it all worked OK.

With a number of properly set up Win10 64 Pro boxes, I had a direct comparison and Win7 64 set up properly was old and it looked like it.

With a smaller computer like an older laptop, you can turn off the MAC interface on Win7, remove any unwanted junk, make sure you have all of the right drivers and you should be able to get it going OK. Have a look at the Intel site for the correct drivers if they still have them available, the OEM site may be able to help you as well.

[NoCforMe]

I think I'm good so far as drivers go. By "OEM" you mean the computer mfr., right? As I wrote, I went to Dell's driver site, only to find that almost none of them would actually load; most said they weren't compatible with my system. But everything seems to be working fine: video, audio, network connectivity.

[Shintaro]

I think I'm good so far as drivers go. By "OEM" you mean the computer mfr., right? As I wrote, I went to Dell's driver site, only to find that almost none of them would actually load; most said they weren't compatible with my system. But everything seems to be working fine: video, audio, network connectivity.

Have you installed the Service Pack HERE.
Maybe the drivers require SP1 as a minimum.

[NoCforMe]

Already got SP1, thanks (the DVD had it).

[jack]

I have a VM with Windows 7 ultimate x64 and I still get updates, especially for defender, so I would recommend that you get the ultimate edition

[greenozon]

Are there any (un)official post SP1 W7 update package (11 years accumulated in one installer)?

[NoCforMe]

I have a VM with Windows 7 ultimate x64 and I still get updates, especially for defender, so I would recommend that you get the ultimate edition

No. I am not about to do yet another OS install at this point. I'm down to one annoying problem (apparently due to screwed up certificate handling by Opera, which probably has nothing to do with the OS), so no thanks. I can live without Micro$oft's updates, thank you very much.