Author Topic: How programming works.....  (Read 2022 times)

Siekmanski

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2018, 12:14:25 AM »
I like to read the comments below the Flat Earth videos, it's hilarious how stupid their claims are.
One of the most used proof is, "The bible says the earth is flat".
Think the left part of their brain is flat too.  :badgrin:
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caballero

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2018, 01:40:55 AM »
 :biggrin:

What this evidence is the difficulty of observing something from within, it is easier to see it from outside, in perspective. Religious beliefs add vitality to some perspectives or others, such as geocentric theories, defended by some scientists until a few centuries ago.

Curiously, these religious beliefs are also based on the interpretation of certain texts, if I'm not wrong. Then perfectly this interpretation could also be wrong.
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zedd151

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2018, 01:43:51 AM »
Lets not forget about the 'hollow earth' theories.  :P

Hollow Earth
 
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hutch--

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #18 on: August 07, 2018, 03:03:17 AM »
Yeah, you could have some fun with that one, a universe that is inside out and the surface we see is the inside of a sphere, not the outside. With a crackpot enough theory you could describe the view of the world being approximately spherical as an optical illusion and if you dug a deep enough hole, you would still not come out in China as there would be no end to the hole depth.
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Siekmanski

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #19 on: August 07, 2018, 03:05:33 AM »
:biggrin:

What this evidence is the difficulty of observing something from within, it is easier to see it from outside, in perspective. Religious beliefs add vitality to some perspectives or others, such as geocentric theories, defended by some scientists until a few centuries ago.

Curiously, these religious beliefs are also based on the interpretation of certain texts, if I'm not wrong. Then perfectly this interpretation could also be wrong.

Believing is nothing else then not knowing and to accept a statement, supposition, or opinion as true.
It creates a confused and dangerous environment and sometimes hilarious moments.

Athiests Are 99% Evil
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MD12OXUliys
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hutch--

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #20 on: August 07, 2018, 04:52:17 AM »
I have always chuckled at religious statements from either athiests or theists. I have no problems with folks who believe things, we all do it somewhere but the only completely rational position is that of the agnostic who states that they do not know either way. I don't know if little green men live on Mars and while I have seen nothing that suggests that they do, I would not waste the time trying to prove that they don't, negative proof is just another branch of nonsense metaphysics.

One of the assumptions most make is that nature is uniform over time but Bertrand Russell produced an example of a turkey that live a life of luxury every day and to the turkey it just happened day after day but at Christmas time it got its head chopped off and was cooked for Christmas dinner.
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hutch--

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #21 on: August 07, 2018, 04:55:17 AM »
While I am at it, I have a view on programming that in OZ is called Rafferty's rules which basically means, if it works, do it. You can put a fancy handle on it and call it "Epistemological Anarchy" but it just means the same thing, if it works, do it.
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caballero

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #22 on: August 07, 2018, 05:48:02 AM »
I'm sorry but it is a bit hard to me to follow the spoken English. A 99% seems to be a bit elevated.

I agree with Hutch that the most logical for me is agnosticism. From my point of view, religion and atheism are two religions because both need faith for their beliefs. While they are soft positions they are perfectly healthy, simply a way of understanding life. They begin to be harmful environments when they begin to be more rigid positions.

If God exists and said "grow and multiply and dominate the earth" surely he did not say it in the sense that we have given it. I think that the human needs a cap, a limitation, because otherwise we would become a despot, with our peers or with our environment. When Nietzsche said "God has died" I think he meant breaking all human chains so that he reaches the maximum. This is fine so as not to be limited by religious prejudices, but it risks breaking all ethical boundaries.

My father defined himself as an atheist and my mother as a believer. Both had very soft positions. A phrase to summarize it: my mother only went to mass at weddings/funerals/communions/christenings and my father accompanied her.
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Siekmanski

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #23 on: August 07, 2018, 06:09:00 AM »
Quote
From my point of view, religion and atheism are two religions because both need faith for their beliefs.

Atheism is not a belief system.
Atheism is the absence of belief in the existence of deities.
While there are some religions that are atheistic (certain sects of Buddhism, for example), that does not mean that atheism is a religion.

Quote
My father defined himself as an atheist and my mother as a believer.

My father was an atheist too and my mother also believed in god.
This turned out well for me, got the looks from my mother and the brains from my father.  :biggrin:
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felipe

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #24 on: August 07, 2018, 09:35:23 AM »
This turned out well for me, got the looks from my mother and the brains from my father.  :biggrin:

I should infer from here that you are saying you are "good" looking?  :lol:
Felipe.

Siekmanski

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #25 on: August 07, 2018, 09:51:50 AM »
This turned out well for me, got the looks from my mother and the brains from my father.  :biggrin:

I should infer from here that you are saying you are "good" looking?  :lol:

No, I never mentioned my mother was good looking, luckily for me "good looks" is a matter of taste.  :biggrin:
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hutch--

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #26 on: August 07, 2018, 02:08:32 PM »
Left overs from studying philosophy at uni long ago. Proof for the existence of God is an ancient field of endeavour and the one I had the most fun with was the "First Mover" argument from the Catholic saint, Thomas Aquinas. His argument went something like this, if each event/situation followed from an earlier one then  the first one is called God.

The obvious response to this is an infinite regression that has no beginning.
The obvious answer to that is how do you prove an infinite regression ?

The conversation usually collapses down to invective, abuse and in historical cases, holy wars and massacres of the infidels (any flavour).

The "theist" holds the first mover as an act of FAITH.
The "agnostic" make no claim in either direction.
The "atheist" holds an infinite regression as an act of FAITH.

The uncommitted "agnostic" is the only one on safe ground here on the claim of being rational, both the theist and the atheist are believers motivated by FAITH and while there is nothing wrong with either "religion", it is a mistake to hold that either has any objective proof.

The "theist" can make the claim from collective testimony that well over a billion believers can't be wrong.
The "atheist" can claim that space appears to go on forever.

I am much of the view that anyone can believe anything as long as they don't try and force you to believe what they believe.
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caballero

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #27 on: August 07, 2018, 04:23:23 PM »
If you are an atheist, I guess that you are convinced that there isn't any God. Thus there's no absence of belief, but a belief of absence of something. Something that noone is able to demonstrate that doesn't exists, so you need of faith for your believe. Hence we are talking about a religion here.
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jj2007

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #28 on: August 07, 2018, 06:39:21 PM »
The uncommitted "agnostic" is the only one on safe ground

That's also my conclusion :t

I am open for surprises - maybe I will find out one day that I live in The Matrix. I am pretty sure, though, that if god exists, she or he or it couldn't care less about those guys in the purple dresses who claim to represent her/him/it on Earth. And most probably, she/he/it will not look like an old white man with a long beard 8)

Yuri

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Re: How programming works.....
« Reply #29 on: August 07, 2018, 07:58:18 PM »
I think what you really believe shows in how you live. If you live as if there is no God, then it's what you believe. Whether you call yourself "atheist" or "agnostic". You can say that you "don't know" in a discussion, but when you have to act, you have to choose what to believe.

If you choose not to go to church, what is your decision based on? It can't be based on knowledge because you "don't know". Obviously it's based on your belief there is no God. And since even the promise of eternal life and the threat of eternal suffering can't outweigh your belief, it's a strong one.

So, there are gnostic atheists, who think they know there is no God, that it can be proved, and there are agnostic atheists, who think it can't be proved (yet) but who nevertheless live as if God doesn't exist.

Of those two groups, the more rational are the gnostic atheists because they live according to their knowledge (be it right or wrong). But the agnostic atheists are definitely irrational because they live according to sheer belief. "I don't know if there is God, so I won't go to church" — where is logic here? Apparently the more rational choice would be "so I will go to church just in case". Because the risk is very big. The cost of the mistake is huge. Actually, the true agnostic would go to all churches available and pray to all gods whose names he can remember. :)