Author Topic: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ  (Read 39988 times)

jj2007

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #15 on: February 04, 2013, 10:29:51 AM »
what disturbed me the most after watching a broadcast about school shootings here was the same response from the adults "when we were young people just beat each other with fist now they use weapons"

Oh ? So violence is OK as long as no guns ?

Violence is never OK, of course. But "when we were young people just beat each other with fist now they use weapons" is just proof that violence happens, and it's strong in the genes of a certain fraction of the population. The only difference between now and then is that those who got a classmate's fist in the face are still alive.

Same applies for suicides, by the way. Rates of attempted suicides are similar in gun-loving and gun-free countries. Rates of "successful" suicide attempts are much higher in the U.S.

OECD (the roof organisation of wealthy industrialised countries) collects statistics on such stuff. Within the OECD, the U.S. are extreme outliers for
- murder (usually expressed as number per 100,000 population per year)
- prison population (same)
- and, not so extreme but pretty significant, life expectancy.

But why look at statistics if you can dream of playing sheriff in the glorious Wild West? Of armed resurrection against the U.S. army? Honestly, those who play the "it's risky if the military are armed and we are not" card, do they ever reflect a second on what bulls**t they are writing? :dazzled:

The old lady that got shot by police? Doesn't happen in countries where cops live without fear that every single idiot regardless of age can hide a Kalashnikov under the burka. If you want to blame culture, go to your culturally closest neighbours, Canada and UK, and check their records. Don't be shy, UK is an extremely outlier in that nobody is allowed to carry guns, not even cops. And no, their murder statistics are not a typo.

Magnum

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #16 on: February 04, 2013, 10:50:06 AM »
I know a teacher, he told me of a high student who hung himself.

He could easily have used a gun. So even if someone could not get a gun,...

<Violence is never OK, of course. But "when we were young people just beat each other with fist now they <use weapons" is just proof that violence happens, and it's strong in the genes of a certain fraction of the <population. The only difference between now and then is that those who got a classmate's fist in the face <are still alive.

That's an extremely simplistic arguement.

A big problem is a lack of anger management, most often brought about by lack of parenting and morals.

A  dentist ran over her cheating husband several times with her daughter in the car in a hotel parking lot.

It's legal in Texas for a parent or a grandparent to discipline a child using spanking.
It was including in a handgun law.

When I was in junior high, we got pops from a thick plywood paddle with a black target painted on the end.

Most students learned fairly quick that there are consequences for misbehavior.

The students who started fights behind the gym, many probably met an early passing away.

Andy


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hutch--

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #17 on: February 04, 2013, 01:55:26 PM »
The obvious has been missed when citing the report, the Uzzi is an ILLEGAL firearm that has arrived in Australia AFTER the draconian gun laws were introduced that were supposed to remove rapid fire weapons from society.  After such far reaching legal right removal it is reasonable to point out the level of FAILURE of the gun control laws. Criminals, drug dealers, bikie gangs, kids buying illegal hand guns for their own protection and an ever more sophisticated collection of weapons by terrorist groups say the gun laws have failed in their stated intent to make society a safer place by removing guns from it.

The price Australians have paid with draconian gun laws is the country is easier to control at the point of a gun but a more dangerous place because of it with an ever more sophisticated range of illegal weapons in the hands of the bad guys.
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hfheatherfox07

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #18 on: February 04, 2013, 02:04:18 PM »
Violence is never OK, of course. But "when we were young people just beat each other with fist now they use weapons" is just proof that violence happens, and it's strong in the genes of a certain fraction of the population. The only difference between now and then is that those who got a classmate's fist in the face are still alive.

Well.... The whole point I that the problem is society not gun control , that will NEVER stop murders ....
Gun control laws are just smoke and mirror to show the public that you are doing something ( even thought it is useless )
If I remember high school correctly there where ; knifes ,baseball bats , machetes , q ball in bandana or sock
Lots of ways not to remain alive !!!
One kid had his face smashed in with cinder block ...
Another kid in shop class had his face sanded off with power sander ....


The old lady that got shot by police? Doesn't happen in countries where cops live without fear that every single idiot regardless of age can hide a Kalashnikov under the burka. If you want to blame culture, go to your culturally closest neighbours, Canada and UK, and check their records. Don't be shy, UK is an extremely outlier in that nobody is allowed to carry guns, not even cops. And no, their murder statistics are not a typo.

I live in Canada and that happened here , tough gun control country, you can not compare us to a country that people put road side bombs ....
As for prison inmates in USA .... Most are in for drugs! A little joint and in prison you go!
Some of the old COPS show still plays on TV .... Not kidding you !
 
Politics .... Some old black and white movies showed how the US government was encouraging farmers to grow marihuana plants , cause hemp produces so much stuff cheaply, until the paper giants realized that will put their logging industry out of business so they created a panic about  marihuana users ( can still view those videos on line so funny!!!)
Not to mention that in the 1900's Coceine was  sold medically ( I have some funny pics )

Instead of fixing drug problem , just put people in jail ... Did not work!!!!
Same as with gun laws ...  A band Aid for stupid people to belive the government is doing something , at the same time propelling us towards a police state !


I believe it is not about people who love guns , or those who want gun control , it is about fixing society to be good! And it starts with each of us the way we act towards others !
That is my whole point gun control is useless and will never stop deaths , think about it ; after that theatre shooting every body was crying tougher gun laws ! But !if that man would have build a pipe bomb ( available parts anywhere ) and added sharp metal chips ( from any machine shop scrap bin ) or nails , ball bearings . He could have thrown that in that packed theatre and walked away , while killing most the people in there .
With No gun ! How will tougher gun laws prevent that ?
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Magnum

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #19 on: February 04, 2013, 02:28:07 PM »
I wonder if body armor is legal in Australia ?

Crossbows ?

Long bows ?

If you had 10 acres or more and some Komodo dragons for cleanup, you might be good to go.

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #20 on: February 04, 2013, 07:07:55 PM »
 :biggrin:

A pea shooter is illegal in Australia.
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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #21 on: February 04, 2013, 07:20:15 PM »
There is a reason why the historical Colt 44 was called "The Great Equaliser".



Without them in the Wild West you were the target of mobs, thugs, Indians, robbers etc etc etc .... A Colt 44 leveled the playing field. A small guy, an old lady, a widow and even kids could defend themselves against what are unbeatable odds with gangs of people. No doubt the wild west was a dangerous place but it was a lot more dangerous if you could not defend yourself.
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hfheatherfox07

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #22 on: February 04, 2013, 07:46:50 PM »
:biggrin:

A pea shooter is illegal in Australia.

Here in Canada we have a chain of stores called "Canadian Tire"
Street slang "crap tire" lol
In the big cities ( even some rural areas now)
They lock up the pellets and Co2 cartegis for pea shooter ( pellet gun, BB guns)
Out of fear that some "crazy criminal" will walk in the store and arm the BB gun and poke some one's eye out!

But huge sharp Axes , Lumber jack saws,sledge hammers , machetes , huge screw drivers , baseball bats are OK
Thank God for that , I am so Afriad of pellets ! But crazy man picking up a huge sharpened Axe and start swinging , or a machete , well .... That is not scary , can't poke some ones eye with that ! :dazzled:
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mywan

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #23 on: February 04, 2013, 11:12:59 PM »
Scenario 1: Public is disarmed - You're not likely to be attacked so therefore not likely to shoot, you take what you want and leave = few, if any people dead
Simply not true. I had some limited experiences in certain neighborhoods when I was young. Places where the probability of being attacked was near certain for the wrong individuals. A lack of guns made nobody in the least bit safer. I think I would rather be shot than beat to death with an axe handle, and I've had experience with being threatened with both.

If you count the total death rate from firearms the total death rate as a result of guns is certainly significantly higher when guns are widely available. How many more deaths than would have otherwise occurred overall is hard to ascertain. The manner in which statistics are collected groups all self defense, murder, accidental, cop shootings, suicide, etc., as a blanket count for "gun violence" numbers. In some ways the approach to gathering statistics is outright hostile towards making any real sense of the causal issues behind it. Just like "police risk", to justify certain laws, includes the auto accidents they get into during normal driving. For that reason there's nothing anybody can say, on either side of the debate, with really definitive numbers to back anything up. What can be said is that most are suicides. But how many suicides do you think you can prevent by taking guns away?

Bottom line is that no guns != no murder/suicide, etc.

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #24 on: February 05, 2013, 12:19:18 AM »
A pea shooter in OZ is an even more dangerous weapon, its a tube that you fit with a split pea, stick it in you mouth and blow hard and the pea shoots out the front of the tube. Now think of the potential for rapid fire if you had a mouth full of split peas, you could fire up to 60 split peas a minute as long as you worked out how to get your breath from time to time. This could truly be a weapon of mass destruction, you could fire so many split peas that you would cause a famine in areas that rely on them for sustenance.

Now you know why they are such a dangerous weapon and must be banned to protect folks who may be in the line of fire or worse, depend on split peas for sustenance.  :P
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Magnum

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #25 on: February 05, 2013, 01:14:54 AM »
Speaking of dangerous weapons, I think cell phone come close.

As in distracted drivers for one.

I am not picking on cell phones, just their irresponsible use.

In many states it's illegal to use them in school zones, and that's pretty much the extent of their regulation.

A few examples,

Friend admitted he t-boned another car while he was using a cell phone while driving

Saw a van driver using his cell, go into another lane while picking up people from a hotel

Have seen police officers using cells while driving and on duty

Andy

I would be interested on cell phone regulation in other countries.

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MichaelW

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #26 on: February 05, 2013, 09:06:55 AM »
Even worse would be a peashooter magnum, large bore, long barrel, with rifling, firing whole peas and able to put an eye out at 20 paces.

Well Microsoft, here’s another nice mess you’ve gotten us into.

hfheatherfox07

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #27 on: February 05, 2013, 10:32:09 AM »
Gangster :


Weapon :



Sniper :



Here we got the Mafia:
http://www.emmawoodphotos.co.uk/blog/?p=103

Notice their dangerous deminor ....
They are all recognized by the Pea shooter amigurumi Plants tattoo




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KeepingRealBusy

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Re: Further failures of the gun grabbers in OZ
« Reply #29 on: February 18, 2013, 07:57:45 AM »