Tenth amendment

[Magnum]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/25/nadine-schweigert-woman-marries-herself_n_1546024.html

Even though her kids choose to stay with their dad, she was strong enuf to not start drinking.

That is pretty positive.

Dave, some friends in high places said that you were aboard the X-37b.

Tell me it ain't so. :-)

[sinsi]

>I am not familiar with Optus.

Who is he ?

[anunitu]

No Mags,not everyone here is christian,in fact one of us is a PAGAN...So hold down the rhetoric about your preferred religious belief. I will not argue bible text with you,though I could because I had to memorize it cover to cover as a kid. And still I became a PAGAN because you meet a better class of people in those circles..

[Gunther]

Hi anunitu,

No Mags,not everyone here is christian,in fact one of us is a PAGAN...So hold down the rhetoric about your preferred religious belief. I will not argue bible text with you,though I could because I had to memorize it cover to cover as a kid. And still I became a PAGAN because you meet a better class of people in those circles..

I know that Andy does not like to hear it, but Christianity has a lot of pagan roots. That's well known.

Gunther

[hutch--]

I can tolerate anyone believing what they like, as long as they don't try and inflict it on other people. Anything that has to be inflicted by force is already a failure and it does not matter who it was, some flavours of early Christianity were inflicted by force, much the same with some flavours of Islam. The Romans did it and others before them. Broad and tolerant societies have a good track record, the alternative is mired in its own failure. Islamic Al Adalus (Spain) was a wonderful place until the north African fanatics invaded and inflicted their own strict Islam, Norman Sicily was a vibrant multi-cultural society until the Normans died out and it became strict Roman Catholic.

When the fanatics take over and inflict their disease on others by force, the wheels start to fall off. Spain went from being a powerhouse to a flop when they kicked out the Muslims and Jews, I wonder why the loonies never learn ?

[Gunther]

I can tolerate anyone believing what they like, as long as they don't try and inflict it on other people.

Amen to that.  :t

Gunther

[caballero]

Spain went from being a powerhouse to a flop when they kicked out the Muslims and Jews

Hmmmm. Are you sure of this?

Spain was a Roman province. You have probably seen the movie Gladiator, Maximo Decimo Meridio lived in Emerita Augusta, capital of Lusitania, one of the largest Roman provinces of Hispania, today known as Mérida, after that was invaded by Goths, Visigoths, etc. During the years 711 to 726 was in turn invaded by Muslims. "La Reconquista" (reconqueror), or process in which Spaniards begin to recover their territory against Muslim invaders starts at 722 and ends at 1492 with the fall of the kingdom of Granada.

The expulsion of the Jews from Spain in 1492 was ordered by the Catholic Monarchs. [Notice the years].

It was the October 12, 1492 when Christopher Columbus at the service of Spain discoveres America. What this man was looking for was an alternate trade route between Spain and India to avoid tolls, relying on the idea that the Earth was round. When he arrived at America he thought he had reached India and called the natives Indians. In fact died without knowing that he had discovered a new continent.

In 1494 Spain and Portugal divided the New World with the Treaty of Tordesillas with the blessing of then Pope. A dividing line to the left for Spain, the rest was drawn to Portugal. In such a way that what it is now known as Brazil was to the right of this dividing line and became part of Portugal.

During the reign of Philip II (king of Spain from 1527 to 1598) the famous phrase "In Spain the sun never sets," he said. Referring to the number of territories that became pertener to Spain: from America to the Philippines. In fact, the name of Phhilippines was in honor of Philip II.

The Spanish Golden Age spans two centuries: XVI and XVII [Notice the years]. One of the last colonies to take independence was Cuba in 1895, long time after the expulsion of Muslims and Jews.

I do not follow much more. The decline of Spain is due to the enormous costs that kept stupid wars and mismanagement.

It is incomprehensible that expelled the Jews from Spain for religious reasons, but the issue of Muslims was a simple matter of reconquest.

Regards

[Magnum]

Andy Taliban K.,

It seems Hutch has read the Holy Bible much more intensely than you will ever be able to do. Jesus had a very special view regarding hypocrits. Watch out, hell may still exist.

And be aware that you are dishonouring the U.S. flag by displaying it close to such bulls**t :icon_redface:

Resorting to name calling. Says much about your character.

[jj2007]

Andy Taliban K.

Resorting to name calling. Says much about your character.

I call you Taliban because you behave like one. Jesus taught his people to love their enemies, but you are full of hatred against anybody who is different. Let's blame your pain for that behaviour, but please stop abusing the Bible for justifying your obsessions.

[Magnum]

You are full of a lot of anger.

But I forgive you and have no hard feelings no how many times you or others attack me.

You can never take away my joy.

[carlos]

Islamic Al Adalus (Spain) was a wonderful place until the north African fanatics invaded and inflicted their own strict Islam,
 Spain went from being a powerhouse to a flop when they kicked out the Muslims and Jews, I wonder why the loonies never learn ?

Al Andalus was not invaded by north african islamic fanatics,  but  by north spain catolic fanatics (Just like Latin America) and you were rigth, the moment jews and muslims were evicted by Los reyes catolicos Spain started his intelectual decadence,

[caballero]

Your post are full of nonsenses and evidences your own prejuices. Where you get your ideas from? That happens when you read only the half of a paper. Al Andalus was a wonderful place for who? I guess that not for spaniards. As i demonstrated in previous post the expulsion of jews and muslims had nothing to do with the declive of Spain.

Cheers

[hutch--]

Sorry guys, I missed your replies. Al Andalus is in fact very well documented and I also have some very good documentary evidence on its history. In about 715AD the Moors began the conquest of the Iberian peninsula eventually establishing the Caliphate of Cordoba. This was the golden era in Islamic Al Andalus with co-operation between Muslims, Jews and Christians in a highly literate and tolerant society. In the 10th century the Berbers began to take control of Al Andalus and with a period of internal civil wars between different Muslim factions, the Islamic grip on Al Andalus began to weaken.

Progressive wars from the Christian monarchs eventually weakened and defeated the remnants of Islamic Al Andalus, this being helped along by the number of knights that returned from the Crusades who had little else to do that fight somewhere else. The last city Granada fell in 1492 and the joint kingdoms of Ferdinand of Aragon and Isabella of Castile took control of what is now Spain. The Jews were expelled in 1492 while the Muslims lasted a little longer in some parts of Spain before being expelled in 1609.

At its best some hundreds of years earlier, Al Andalus was the source of much of the ancient knowledge from the Greek and Roman period that had been lost in Europe but had survived in the Islamic countries. Authors like Tacitus, Seutonius, Plato and many others came back into Europe through Moorish Spain. At its worst closer to its end, it became rigidly intolerant of non-Muslim religions.

The new Spain was a mixed blessing, instead of the heavy handed Berber influence, they had heavy handed Catholic influence at the hands of people like Tomás de Torquemada and the less than pleasant experience of people being burnt alive for being suspected of being secret Jews and other deviations from Catholicism. It was the French under Napoleon who eventually freed Spaniards from fear of the Inquisition.

Now interestingly enough, the Moors tried to invade what is now France in the 7th Century but ran into Charles "The Hammer" Martel who decisively defeated the invasions and the Moors never gained a foothold in France.
 

[caballero]

I'm impressed about your knowledge of Spain history. Nevertheless the origin of Spain was Hispania as a province of Rome. It was invaded several times, and also by muslims. I fear that in those days invasions were pretty bloody. Don't believe that Christians Spaniards were so happy with that. What I never understood when I studied this issue was why the Jews were expelled. A people that has suffered many blows, I'm afraid.

Regards

[anunitu]

One thing you always need to remember,these things are acts of EMPIRE,not really religion,though the two are melded at times.