Author Topic: new member introduction and advice  (Read 10804 times)

q12

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new member introduction and advice
« on: September 04, 2021, 12:42:56 PM »
Hello,
 I am a brand new member and I am new to assembler. I know SOME stuff, but not that much. I am a rookie but not from 0, but from 5. I have some notions and I read some assembler articles. I also did code a little bit of pic mcu, like 12F508 and 16F84. Again, Im not that new.
 I have an idea about masm32... I install it already on my current OS (windows7)
 My priority is to learn asm for PIC's. I imagine this asm comunity is more responsive than microcontroler comunity (in general); so thats why I redirected here with you. I hope I am right. My hope is to learn windows asm more faster than with microcontrollers. At least a good introduction and to spin my wheels.
 I am looking forward to learn a little bit more about this thing.
Any constructive thoughts are welcomed. Links, tutorials, videos, anything that will push me faster and further.
Thank you very much!
« Last Edit: September 04, 2021, 02:18:48 PM by q12 »

jj2007

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #1 on: September 04, 2021, 06:36:08 PM »
Hi q12,

See Masm32: What you absolutely need to get started for some basics. You are optimistic with regard to help from the Masm32 community for PICs. Members here are very helpful in general, but almost nobody works with PICs...

Welcome to the Forum :thup:

q12

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #2 on: September 04, 2021, 10:22:29 PM »
Excelent! Thanks for the help! I will start look into your recomandations.  :thumbsup:
 The PIC's are my problem, or better say, is my drive, my end goal, my destination.
I want a foot in the door with assembler, and I am struggling for years with it, (from 1998) and with great(also years) breaks between attempts. I started some tutorials, many years ago, I understood them for a couple of days, and by not repeating, I forget everything I learned and exercised back then. But at least I know it is possible. Haha.
 But now, I say enough. I want to commit to it. So I had the great inspiration to get a turn into masm assembler, its out of the box thinking for me. I really hope it will help me develop a minimum of "foot in the door". I dont expect much. A little is enough for me. You know, I am thinking like the person who didnt have it and when it does, is happy with as little as he can get. Thats totally me right now.
 I want you mister @jj2007  to give me a summary of what you can build with masm.  From my general knowledge, I know is hardware dependent, and more precise, CPU and ram dependent. If Im not mistaken GPU dependent as well (in videocards) since now exists GPU+CPU on the same board. What im more interested is what do you usually do with masm, give me some details. Tell me your story, or general stuff, to push me more forward.
Thank you for now and I expect great help from you !   :wink2:

q12

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #3 on: September 04, 2021, 11:30:19 PM »
Updates for the help so far
(It is a good thing to offer an alternative link, on Google Drive, or similar)
-When I click on your link there (the red marked one)
:
-The page is not loading
:


TimoVJL

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #4 on: September 05, 2021, 12:11:37 AM »
Perhaps Siekmanski can help you, as he knows some MCUs.
May the source be with you

q12

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #5 on: September 05, 2021, 12:53:31 AM »
Thank you mister @TimoVJL
 Interesting idea, but I really meant what I said. I only want to get some good introduction, to learn it a little bit. To start my wheels spinning.
 Also, I dont want to bother anyone important here with my rookie problems and especially on completely other direction than the masm you are working with routinely.
In the near future, I will certainly consider your idea, to search for people that know MCU asm... but until then, I need to get my feet wet. I feel im not ready for any serious discussion on that level yet.
 Plus, I will learn some new tools, new concepts, I know for sure they will be new. Haha.
 Btw, I already collected and installed, a bunch of recommended tools from masm32 [intro.txt] file

and this forum page link(s).  Pity I could not continue with the MasmBasic package link. I hope it will get resolved soon. I finished the first page to read and also downloaded the recomanded pdf book in there: [Art Of Intel x86 Assembly.pdf]

So, I'm doing my homework as best as I can.
 I know is hard. I'll give it my best.
Thank you.

jj2007

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #6 on: September 05, 2021, 08:55:08 PM »
Updates for the help so far
(It is a good thing to offer an alternative link, on Google Drive, or similar)
-When I click on your link there (the red marked one)

Sorry, I changed provider some time ago and forgot to adjust some links. Try again with Ctrl F5 to refresh the cache.

q12

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #7 on: September 06, 2021, 12:15:57 AM »
 - You made another mistake with the links.
[Hello world] page contains a link to [MasmBasic] page and the link inside [MasmBasic], the red marked one, opens back the [Hello world] page. So it's full circle now.

---
 - Hey, it's ok, really, I will learn masm as it is , without [MasmBasic] thing, which I truly have no idea what it does in reality, and I will use it a limited time anyway, since my rookie level. Sincerely, it's ok if you can't fix the link.
 - I will need your advice from time to time though, while working in the normal masm32. I will follow a tutorial of course for it, but it will be great if I will get some feedback at some points there. Thanks in advance. And I really wish I can start and continue practice this very hard thing. We'll see. All in good time.

daydreamer

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #8 on: September 06, 2021, 03:37:31 AM »
Welcome Q12 :thumbsup:
I want you mister @jj2007  to give me a summary of what you can build with masm.  From my general knowledge, I know is hardware dependent, and more precise, CPU and ram dependent. If Im not mistaken GPU dependent as well (in videocards) since now exists GPU+CPU on the same board. What im more interested is what do you usually do with masm, give me some details. Tell me your story, or general stuff, to push me more forward
you can do anything in masm,but for SSE2 instructions or later you need to get a later ML version,than included in masm32 package
do you use your computer for crossdevelop PIC to make it easier?
I use crossdevelopment tools on PC for programmable calculator,much more convenient than type directly on annoying tiny keyboard on calculator
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hutch--

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2021, 10:05:04 AM »
Hi q12,

First, welcome on board, you will have a ton of fun here as many people well understand 32 bit MASM. While starting out, stick to the installation of MASM32 and once you get the swing of it, you can tweak whatever you like and add whatever you like. When you have been at it for long enough to understand it better, you can use a later version of the assembler ML.EXE.

PIC is not my field but if you get the swing of instruction sets and the inherant logic of using assembler instructions, the transition to PIC assembler may becomes a bit more familiar.

Something that is very useful when you are learning the instructions is a simple console form of executable as it isolates you from the complexities of Windows user interfaces so you can concentrate on just the instructions and how to use them.
hutch at movsd dot com
http://www.masm32.com    :biggrin:  :skrewy:

q12

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2021, 11:38:41 AM »
Hello mister @hutch
"PIC is not my field but if you get the swing of instruction sets and the inherant logic of using assembler instructions, the transition to PIC assembler may becomes a bit more familiar."
-  I could not say it more better than you said it !!!  It is Exactly my original thought. My believe is that learning a bit of "true" assembler, or the "origin" like masm32 here, (again) I believe it is, the correct way and will enhance my skills, especially with my "target" PIC's coding (at which I suck !greatly!).

"Something that is very useful when you are learning the instructions is a simple console form of executable as it isolates you from the complexities of Windows user interfaces so you can concentrate on just the instructions and how to use them"
- I think you are pointing out that using only "cmd" console ... (the cmd.exe in windows/system32 folder), will help me focus only on the instructions themselves. I think  I understand you now. The thing is... I am absolutly Not familiar with using a console for writing asm. I only used a console for directives/commands to windows folders and some files and some other console type programs, like for example youtube-dl.exe (which is fantastic good by the way). Heh. Yes, pretty new idea with asm in console for me.
 - How do I use asm in console?
 Any good starting tutorials for me? I am very interested in themes, problems to resolve, that will help me advance in my asm learning. If you happen to know some "problems" to resolve and learn with them, for starting people like me. Or write a list yourself, it should not be that hard for someone experienced. I thank you in advance for them!

hutch--

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #11 on: September 06, 2021, 01:41:49 PM »
A console app in asm is still written in assembler, its RUN from the console and only has a simple console interface. The MASM32 SDK has a directory of tutorials which would be useful for you to have a look at.
hutch at movsd dot com
http://www.masm32.com    :biggrin:  :skrewy:

q12

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2021, 01:53:58 AM »
I did try it before your recommendation and it didn't work.
But today I tried a bit more than before... because I believed in your advice.
And the FIRST program in [demo1] folder, namely the hello.exe didnt output anything.
But, I said to try the next [demo2] folder, namely the proc.exe and that, for my amazement, it worked. Ohoa ! That is something.
Hey, thanks for the influence ! Good influence ! Hehe.


HSE

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2021, 04:31:12 AM »
Hi q12!

Open hello.asm with QEditor.

Use menu Project > Console Assemble & Link.

Regards, HSE.

Equations in Assembly: SmplMath

q12

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Re: new member introduction and advice
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2021, 05:34:12 AM »
Hello mister @HSE
Thank you, that worked.
I am copying and thinking as much as I can on the directives I see here. They look very close to a high level language. I personally know c#, and I already was introduced to a method/function that here in asm is called "procedure". Fantastic. I presume all that bunch of include files in the begining of each code, is actually enable this high level feel. I think is cool....Until I reach the numbers part.Hehe.
I am playing with the code I just copied, to familiarize myself and I didnt finished the console tutorial yet. I plan to make in the end a custom code, with the things learned in this compact tutorial. I'll update you soon.
 - And thank you for your support so far !